Top5 Ways to Succeed as a Woman in Leadership

Karen Parisi, CMO at CentralReach, joined Tara Thurber to share her career growth, professional development and insights on women in leadership roles. Together, Karen and Tara delve into the Top5 Ways to Succeed as a Woman in Leadership.

Top5 Ways to Succeed as a Woman in Leadership
1. Try Everything
2. Authenticity
3. Don’t Hesitate
4. Hire Smarter
5. Team Culture

ABOUT KAREN: Karen Parisi is the Chief Marketing Officer at CentralReach where she oversees all marketing efforts for the company. In this role, Karen is responsible for developing new growth strategies and building the company’s brand across the autism and IDD care space. 

Prior to CentralReach, she founded and led Oodi, a software platform for marketing agencies to manage their end-to-end operations. She previously held a number of other marketing roles at global technology companies, Thomson Reuters and iCIMS.

Karen holds a Bachelor of Science in Finance and a Minor in Japanese from Villanova University.

Transcript

Karen Parisi: 0:00

Hey everyone, welcome back to Top5 brought to you by DefinedTalent. We are a results driven service working with clients to connect them with quality talent, as well as working to make an impact within the recruiting industry. We talk straight about today's professional world with real world professionals, experts in recruitment, job seekers and business owners alike. Have a question for us. Send it in and you might spur our next conversation. I'm Tara Thurber, co founder and director of talent partnerships here at DefinedTalent. And joining me today is Karen Parisi, Chief Marketing Officer at Central Reach. Hi, Karen, how are you today? Hi, good. So excited to be here.

Tara Thurber: 0:42

Welcome, welcome. Let's dive in. And would you be able to just give myself in the audience a little bit about your background?

Karen Parisi: 0:50

Sure. So I'm a marketer now, I wasn't always a marketer. Actually, in school, I studied finance, I had a minor in Japanese. After school, I said, if I don't go to Japan now, I never will. So I actually moved to there for about a year and a half to teach English. And as soon as I came back, it was a terrible time to find finance jobs. So I was actually at work for 18 months, I worked as a receptionist, while I searched for a job in finance.

Tara Thurber: 1:22

Right.

Karen Parisi: 1:22

And then, you know, one of the things that I kind of discovered early on was my passion for other things beyond the finance world. And as part of that process of looking for the next step in my career.

Tara Thurber: 1:37

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 1:38

I decided I had this love for marketing, I always wanted to try, it didn't necessarily have any skills or experience in marketing beyond what I learned in school.

Tara Thurber: 1:45

Right.

Karen Parisi: 1:46

And so I found this internship at a company called iSense. And at the time, they were much smaller than they are today. They're a huge company today. But I applied, and I was able to get the job. And so during that internship, there was no promise of a full time job. But I said I'll do whatever I can, it wasn't paid, but I had the opportunity to really learn some new new skills, I did a lot of self learning during that time to understand, you know, different things that I hadn't done before.

Tara Thurber: 2:22

Right.

Karen Parisi: 2:22

And I used my colleagues to kind of learn the job, and to the point where I was able to master those skills pretty quickly. And within two months, I was offered a full time job in their marketing department.

Tara Thurber: 2:37

Wow!

Karen Parisi: 2:38

So it was a great way to get my foot in the door, get to know people, you know, and learn a new set of skills at the same time that I knew that I could do.

Tara Thurber: 2:45

Right.

Karen Parisi: 2:45

I just needed the opportunity to do it.

Tara Thurber: 2:47

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 2:48

So from there, I wore many hats. So I at one point, I was doing a little bit of their PR, and then eventually, I kind of moved into a demand generation role where I was responsible for Prospect Marketing at the time, as well as some customer marketing. And it was within that role that my career really accelerated. So eventually, I was promoted to manager. And then that led me to my next company, which was Thomson Reuters, where I was responsible for beyond just demand generation, I kind of ran their demand generation team, but also worked closely with the CMO around our marketing organization, and how we could operate better, more efficiently and more effectively. And so that was a great kind of milestone in my career where I really got exposed to efficiency and workflow within the marketing organization that has kind of helped me in my role today.

Tara Thurber: 3:51

Right.

Karen Parisi: 3:52

After that, I went on to actually start my own company. It was a software company for basically project management for marketing agencies. And you'll hear me say this, I'm sure many people have heard me say this before, wasn't a success financially. But it was success in so many other ways in terms of what I learned in that role, and what I was able to accomplish the relationships I was able to develop, and then just my overall business acumen that came from that. After that, I came here to Central Reach, where I am now the Chief Marketing Officer. So when I first started at Central Reach, we were about to focus on the marketing team. And so I was really responsible for building it from the ground up.

Tara Thurber: 4:36

Right.

Karen Parisi: 4:37

And we are thriving and scaling and growing fast today.

Tara Thurber: 4:41

So amazing what a story to go to be going to school for financing completely come into a totally different world over the course of your professional career so far.

Karen Parisi: 4:55

Yeah. Yeah. And I think I kind of started to say this a little bit before.

Tara Thurber: 4:59

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 5:01

At the time, I thought I didn't have the skill set to learn these new roles. But the reality was I did. When I was in Japan, I was teaching English, I was responsible for getting new students enrolled in the school. And marketing played a huge role in that. And so a big part of you know, when I applied for that marketing internship was showing that, hey, I may not have that direct experience, but I can definitely do this role, and here's why. So I think that played a huge role.

Tara Thurber: 5:26

I just got goosebumps, because, you know, nowadays, we're talking to so many young professionals that are getting out of school, and maybe they weren't in for what they wanted, or they're kind of struggling to figure out their next steps. And that outside experience is so important. So important, the projects, the outside projects that one does, or the experience, because that, essentially, that outside work brought that fire that passion to life for you, in a totally different way.

Karen Parisi: 6:02

Yeah, and it gives you exactly and it gives you a different perspective too. One of the things when I'm looking for when I'm hiring for my team is I don't always necessarily look for do you have you have that exact experience, or is it from that industry? Because the reality is that some of the best ideas I've had, or have come to me come from folks that are outside the bubble that we think of that we have to hire for.

Tara Thurber: 6:27

Right.

Karen Parisi: 6:28

And so that's something that has always played a role, I think in in my success, and I think people that are nervous about going for a role that they've never done before, or that is outside of their current experience, I would just stress that you've got this. Just think about your transferable skill set, and how it applies to this new role. And, you know, articulate that when you're when you're speaking to the manager or whoever you're speaking to.

Tara Thurber: 6:55

Right. So amazing. When we're talking about women in leadership, in your opinion, what are some of the most common challenges that women are facing in leadership today? (laughs)

Karen Parisi: 7:11

You know I hate to state the obvious on this one. But honestly, I think, when you think about the biggest challenge that women face is that these biases that occur in the workplace, that are just so ingrained in the workplace, and how companies operate, that are often you know, outside of women's control.

Tara Thurber: 7:38

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 7:39

And so when you think about that, if someone has certain expectations of how you should act, or who you should be in the workforce, and they put that on you how do I help them overcome that?

Tara Thurber: 7:51

Yeah, Right,

Karen Parisi: 7:51

And why is that my job to help them overcome that so that I can kind of show that, hey, I can do this job, I can lead this company, I can help you accomplish what you need to accomplish? And I think as I've thought about my career, I think that's been one of the biggest challenges that I've faced is how do we how do we change the systemic biases that we face at work? And honestly, I think we have made a lot of progress. But when you think about it, obviously, women and workforce in the labor market and during World War Two, but it really wasn't until the 60s with the feminist movement, where you saw this kind of greater influx of women in the workplace.

Tara Thurber: 8:31

Right.

Karen Parisi: 8:32

And that's not that long ago.

Tara Thurber: 8:36

It's not that long ago at all.

Karen Parisi: 8:39

No. And so when you think about it, it's just, we still have so much progress that we need to make around some of these systemic biases that we face. And I think when I've thought about this, how do we overcome that? Right,.

Tara Thurber: 8:52

Right.

Karen Parisi: 8:55

A big part of overcoming that challenge is, I think, for men and women and all people to recognize that we need to continue to address that we need to continue to be aware, if we're putting expectations on how a gender or non gendered person should act, or look, or to accomplish or be a leader, that we need to challenge ourselves to think a little differently of, well, maybe I shouldn't be putting those expectations on that person. You know and I think the last thing I'll say with that is I'm a white woman with privilege. The uphill biases that black and minority women face are even more astounding. So, you know, again, I think we need to just as leaders ourselves, as companies, ourselves, even the most progressive ones, we just need to constantly remind ourselves of what expectations we might be putting on other people.

Tara Thurber: 9:49

Absolutely. I love that. Just the focus on its the expectations and perhaps limiting the expectations and letting these individuals, these women grow and evolve. And I think also women supporting women is huge. And as we continue to help raise each other up, we're able to raise ourselves up too. So it's that constant it's that constant flow, it's that give and take with one another, in order to help make a bigger impact.

Karen Parisi: 10:24

Yeah. And I think you, that brings up a good point. So I have a little bit of a story that, again, some folks have heard, but we as women also need to support each other, and then again, check ourselves too.

Tara Thurber: 10:39

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 10:40

Early on in my career, I had a manager who was a woman, and I was passed over for a promotion, because I was considered too nice for the role and the expectation was that that would not be a good fit for a manager role at the time. And I took that as an opportunity not to say, Okay, let me let me figure out how to be a jerk or whatever.

Tara Thurber: 11:05

Yeah (laughs).

Karen Parisi: 11:05

But rather just lean into who I am, I don't want to be that person, I don't thrive in that environment. I like being nice. But I also like being smart. And I know, I'm smart. And I don't think the two necessarily have to be at conflict with one another. And I think I can do both to lead people successfully. And hopefully, I am the use case, or the story or the example for those that are similar to me, that you can succeed by being authentic to who you are, which is really going to hurt myself here. But yeah, one of the things that I hold very dearly.

Tara Thurber: 11:39

The authenticity rings, so true to my core, and the fact that you didn't stop, you kept going. I feel like a lot of individuals may take that comment. And some people may take that and go, you know, with a negative approach, and lessen themselves, or change themselves to be something that they're not, whereas you took that as an opportunity. And I think that's so important for, for women nowadays, to really understand that, the authenticity of being who you are, allows you to grow as a better leader and allows you to flourish and raise the the energy that surrounds you differently. Because you're holding your truth, right? You're holding your own true self in a role. And if you believe in yourself, and you can pick yourself up after a comment like that, or really just grow confidence within it. The sky's the limit, and proof is in your story, where you went from that, and you didn't stop you kind of said, Okay, thank you. And you stepped it up a little bit more, and stepped it up and stepped it up. So I mean, congratulations on taking it that way.

Karen Parisi: 13:08

Yeah.

Tara Thurber: 13:09

But so important for individuals to know and hear that.

Karen Parisi: 13:13

Yeah, absolutely. And just so for anyone out there, it took me a second to get there.

Tara Thurber: 13:19

Right (laughs).

Karen Parisi: 13:20

It may take you that second together may take a week or two to say Oh, right. I should take this that way. And that's okay, too. It may not come instantly.

Tara Thurber: 13:27

Yeah, totally.

Karen Parisi: 13:29

Cool.

Tara Thurber: 13:30

You know, Karen, also going into this age of this work life balance that's out there now. I mean, whether you're fully remote hybrid, or back in the office full time, how do women or how should women prioritize or balance self care? Family responsibilities, hobbies, work, I feel that it's so much harder for for women to own all of their roles within this work life balance, and I don't even call it a work life balance anymore. I call it more of this life blend that we're all in now. What are your thoughts around that?

Karen Parisi: 14:15

Oh, God, I wish I had an answer for this.

Tara Thurber: 14:18

(laughs)

Karen Parisi: 14:19

I think you just got to do your best. Some days you're gonna have that perfect balance where you get everything right, you finish your work on time you get home, you need to go to the gym in the morning. You have dinner with family and you get everyone to their activities on time. And then and because prioritize all the right way.

Tara Thurber: 14:38

Right. Right.

Karen Parisi: 14:40

And then the next day, something will come up and it will go downhill fast.

Tara Thurber: 14:45

(laughs)

Karen Parisi: 14:45

I'm almost 40 I have three kids I still struggle with with balancing it all. And I have a feeling that I when I'm in my 50s or 60s. I'm going to still struggle to balance it all. We're human. And I think no one has work life balance figured out perfectly or, again, they might have it perfect on one day, and not so perfect on the next day. But I think it doesn't mean that when you fall off the horse, and things are hard, that you can't get back on. And so the trick that I've used for me is just hoping communication, and especially with my partner, my boss, my team making it clear when I need help, or I might need a little extra time on something, or I need to get home for dinner or whatever it might be. And then, and that open communication, constant communication has been critical and kind of helping those kind of tough days that I don't have it figured out. And then a little grace. I think, as your whether you have a ton of activities or not, think, again, we're it's hard to balance, and it will forever be hard to balance. But you will figure it out. And it's okay, you're doing your best. And so just, tomorrow's a new day.

Tara Thurber: 16:02

I love that feedback, Karen, because in speaking to a lot of different people throughout the years, and most recently I think there's this stigma around females and women in the workplace where, oh, well, of course, they have to leave early because they have to do this and take their kids and of course. And I think as, as a mother of two that two children that are extremely busy. It you're right, it's that communication. And it's that openness to say, hey, team, Hey, boss, this is our schedule, or this is what I need to do today and not feeling guilty about it. I think a lot of women hold this internal guilt when they have to leave right at five o'clock one day. And it's not noticed if they stay or are working until seven, eight o'clock, nine o'clock or they leave early at five and then they're logging back in at eight or nine o'clock to wrap up their day. It's definitely that communication. And it's it's the the leadership and the flexibility. I think that's most important. And then for women prioritizing. I strongly believe we all need more self care. Nowadays, there's so much around burnout, there's so much around, just breakdowns. And I think as we need to, we need to put it on our calendars, block time for ourselves, and not forget that if our cups aren't filled, then how are we going to do that for the rest of our team, for the rest of our company, for the rest of our families? So I feel like that's also, you know, it's hard to prioritize, because I feel also that a lot of people are moving very, very fast right now, because there's so much coming at them at once. But if you can just take a step back and breathe and know that not every day is going to going to be perfect, right? Not every day is going to be getting the kids to where they need to on time, dinner on the table, whatever the case may be. And being okay in that space. I think is really important for individuals to know that it doesn't mean that you failed for the day, it doesn't mean that you're failing. It's just a matter of tomorrow's a new day. Today is what it is. And tomorrow's a new day.

Karen Parisi: 18:45

Agreed. Agreed. And I think the calendar trick is great, too. So we not only do my husband and I have a shared calendar that kind of keeps track of everything. Obviously, I have that for work, too. But I'll put my work stuff in there. So he's aware.

Tara Thurber: 18:58

Yep.

Karen Parisi: 18:59

You know, it's been really helpful on the self care side of the house to my, massage here and there is great, and it's on the calendar and scheduled.

Tara Thurber: 19:08

(laughs) Yeah, it's on the calendar. It's scheduled. And, I couldn't agree more with the shared calendars and just having the eyes on it, my husband being able to have eyes on it, or, my team, looking at the calendar saying, okay, Tara is blocked this, this time, this time, this time this time, I mean, and I mix them together, so and color coded so that it's organized in a way where at least there's openings. And when there's openings, the team can see that and if I'm going to be offline, fully offline for an hour or two here and there then everybody's aware and it's also putting your hand up and saying, Hey, I need a little bit of help on this. I think it's really important to.

Karen Parisi: 19:57

Agreed.

Tara Thurber: 19:57

Alright, so women earn an average of 16% less than men. How can women successfully prove their and I'm doing air quotes over here, their worth, demonstrate their experience level and negotiate a fair salary?

Karen Parisi: 20:19

Negotiation sucks.

Tara Thurber: 20:20

Yeah (laughs).

Karen Parisi: 20:22

Just have equal pay, come on!

Tara Thurber: 20:24

Right? (laughs)

Karen Parisi: 20:25

Yeah, no it's not cool. This is a challenge. And I do think obviously, that's the stat and there's probably much worse. But that's not okay. We still need to get to parity. But I think one of the things that I've seen with the best of the best at negotiation, and honestly, I'm not one of them. I've gotten better, but is one thing I've learned to do. And this is from those that I've looked up to, or asked for advice, or this and that is, and it's not just say this. I've gotten this advice from some of my female mentors as well. But it's not just male, I guess I should say, but, female mentors to o that, they just don't have this fear of asking, and they shouldn't. Right? So what's the worst answer you get? By asking? No, you're not gonna get fired for asking for a raise or asking for equal compensation. And I think that's, I think that's an

Tara Thurber: 21:26

Yeah. Right.

Karen Parisi: 21:26

And this is something that again, my my important reminder, as you're going into these conversations, mentors have always talked about is, make sure you understand do your best to move that fear out of your brain, because it's not going to be held against you, or unless the person is, who knows. But most often, it's not going to be held against you, you're not gonna get fired, it's worth asking for. And when you're in the job interview process, obviously, there's, this is a delicate situation. But again, doesn't hurt to ask, and they will kind of work with you on whatever budget they have to work with. But you should always ask for what you deserve. I think the second thing is do your research. every aspect of your compensation, whether, especially as you progress in your career.

Tara Thurber: 22:22

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 22:22

You're going to have other kinds of components into your compensation. And, you know, before you go into that negotiation process, write it down on paper, write down the points on, you know, on what you want to ask why you want to ask it, and then practice. I will often use my husband to kind of roleplay with me, this type of conversation, and at least in my career in the past, or my friends or again, my, my sister, and while it's still I'm always anxious during it, like it has helped, if I can do it ahead of time, it will be easier in the moment.

Tara Thurber: 23:04

I think you made some good points there on the research aspects, I think a lot of candidates are individuals, companies pay differently, quite honestly. There's like, almost like a little bit of a sliding scale. But it's definitely something around the research, the research of even your role and what other companies are paying different sizes of companies and what they're paying or what the market is showing. And definitely coming to the table at times with data points, I find has been extremely important when asking for a raise, asking for more money or quite honestly, when you're applying and interviewing. A lot of times the negotiation part, sure there's always going to be the negotiation and always negotiate. I would say anybody interviewing or anybody that is looking for increase in their salary, they may say no, but what about if you say, Okay, well, what about this instead? Right? Meet meet me halfway to where I'm at today. Never be afraid to keep pushing it a little bit further and a little bit further until you feel that until you feel satisfied, and happy with the negotiation and happy with the final outcome. I think is really important to not give up. Really finding that confidence and owning that worth and believing in yourself going into any form of negotiation. I want to say like, Just do it!

Karen Parisi: 25:05

(laughs)

Tara Thurber: 25:05

But it's it's one of those things that it's a very hard thing to do. And even myself, I have a tough time with it. And I work with candidates on how to teach them how to do and but I think, definitely it's the data points. It's the practicing asking, being able to speak to somebody and look at them in the eyes and say, this is what I'm looking for. and not be afraid, don't just shut down. If they say no, right out of the gate. Maybe it's give it a couple of months and say, well, I'll come back, and we can revisit this next quarter or, you know, but definitely stand up for yourself, I think is is a good, a good point, or anybody out there.

Karen Parisi: 25:50

Agreed. Agreed.

Tara Thurber: 25:52

So I am definitely into wanting to know your top five ways to succeed as a woman in leadership today.

Karen Parisi: 26:02

Yeah, totally. So I've kind of touched upon some of this already. But you know, I'll give you my top five. So number one, try everything. And before I go into detail on what that means, again, I know it's not fair, because we all know that our male counterparts don't always have to do that to get the promotion. And I think as women, we do need to jump through more hoops. And I'm not saying that you have to do this. But one of the things that has helped me in my evolution as a professional, is to try different things. It all started with that internship, as I was talking about before, I applied myself to tasks that I did not know how to do prior that I learned how to do that, I could then put in my my tool bag for future use.

Tara Thurber: 26:59

Right. Right.

Karen Parisi: 27:00

And I think by always saying yes to taking on new responsibilities, while still being committed to my core responsibilities. Again, it helped me think differently, learn new things, achieve more, to then show that I could take on a new role. So as I was, again, whether I was going from a manager to director or, or individual, employee to manager, or even the role I'm in today, I think I had this, what appear to be random set of skills that I could then craft into the role that I was going for, and show why it would be applicable and why it would be successful in that role to take that on. And then in that new role that would do the same thing. So I really think it does come back to try everything that can help you progress your career and learn new things. Number two, again, I also kind of talked about this before, but lean into you that authenticity is so important. And not even because, people like to trust and work with people they know are being honest, but you'll feel better. I was so much more comfortable in my skin, as a manager, as a leader, when I could be who I wanted to be, and show my team who I really am that it doesn't differ too much from how I am at home. And so I think that authenticity can help women be themselves and be comfortable in their roles and you know, be comfortable in new roles that they might move up into. And then going back to the what we talked about in the beginning of this podcast is that the more we can be authentic, and the more we can be ourselves, the more we can make other people aware of the expectations they're putting on us to start unraveling some of that systemic biases that we're talking about. I think we just need to do it more. And that

Tara Thurber: 29:11

Yeah. will again, ultimately, over time play a huge role in the future of women in the workplace. Love that. I love that so much (laughs).

Karen Parisi: 29:21

Yeah, yeah, it's important to me, as you can say, three, don't hesitate to ask for some time with your executive leaders, especially the women. I think those who have progressed in their career likely face many of the challenges that you have and can coach and mentor on your specific situation. I know it's sometimes hard to hear general advice and then I don't know how to take that and translate that into my specific situation. So so go to those executives, talk to them. I have no doubt they will be happy to talk to you. I would love whether they're in my on my team or outside of my team. If someone in my company came to me and said, Hey, I'm running into this issue, like, I'd love to get your advice.

Tara Thurber: 30:05

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 30:05

I would, I would go out to coffee with them.

Tara Thurber: 30:07

(laughs)

Karen Parisi: 30:08

I would encourage you to do that. I think it's important, as we help this next generation of women and leadership and moving them forward, and to my executive colleagues out there to do that, as well.

Tara Thurber: 30:22

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 30:23

And then number four, hire smarter experts and managers. So one of the first things I learned as a leader was I'm expertise I'm good at what I do. But there are areas that if I had to execute today, I would probably struggle. And so as you're progressing in your career, it's really important that you hire really strong, effective people below you that can they may know more than you on a particular topic. That's okay.

Tara Thurber: 30:51

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 30:52

And that's what you want, because they will help you execute on your vision. And excel, ultimately, whatever your particular strategy is, initiative, etc, to allow you to then level up your own career, or look at the kind of the next phase with focus than had you not hired, I think the right people in your career. So this is for your managers out there, or even directors out there, really think about that when you're in the hiring process. And then final five of our five or fifth one. So number five, is of the same vein as the hiring the right people, as a leader, one of the things that I focus on is how can I boost my team, I've hired the right people, they're experts in they're super smart, super talented. How do I make them thrive? And a big part of that is the culture that we've set up within my organization, and of course, the broader organization, but when I think about it, we work hard, we work very collaboratively together, not only in the marketing function, but across functionally too.

Tara Thurber: 32:09

Right. Right.

Karen Parisi: 32:10

But we have fun doing it. So not in a forced way, but we just make each other laugh. And that has, it's small, but it's made a huge role in allowing us to enjoy coming to work every day, doing what we're doing, making the progress that we are growing the way we are. And so as you're thinking about your team culture, and what you can do, that will ultimately help boost you and your career. Focus on boosting your team. And I always say laughter is probably one of the key successes to any of my relationships, both professionally and not.

Tara Thurber: 32:52

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 32:53

And so infuse that into your teams. And I think you'll see that ultimately, it will make them successful, and it will make you successful.

Tara Thurber: 33:01

I love all five of these, I think all five of these really play an amazing, important role in women in leadership and women that are focused on and progressing into leadership. I think by taking these top five ways from this podcast, I feel it can set up individuals to be successful. Not only in a role, but also emotionally and energetically to be successful, and able to show up as their best selves in order to lead, in order to raise up their team, in order to progress and be successful. So amazing. Thank you for sharing those top five. I want to add just a fun question in here for you and really excited to to know the answer is who do you consider a role model, or a female leader you particularly look up to?

Karen Parisi: 34:08

Alright, so I thought about this a little bit.

Tara Thurber: 34:12

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 34:12

And there are kind of public facing ones that I look up to, I think the most important female leader that I looked up to is actually my sister. So she's three years older than me. She's paved the way on a lot of things growing up and also in the workforce.

Tara Thurber: 34:27

Right (laughs).

Karen Parisi: 34:28

You know, funny, she's actually has a chief strategy officer and the Chief Marketing Officer, so I probably subconsciously followed in her footsteps along the way. But I'll tell you why. So, yes, we're best

Tara Thurber: 34:37

Right! friends. We agree on many things, but there's also very different types of individuals. And we do think about things a little differently in a lot of ways. But what I've been able to tap into her for is to think about things from a different perspective. And that's given me food for thought on how I want to change my approach to whatever it is I'm going to her for. Right.

Karen Parisi: 35:08

And so, point being that you don't always need the cheerleader, she's, of course a cheerleader to me. But she's also want to give me some honest feedback to help me think a little differently. I actually, just this week, I sat down with a board member of one of our board members, who similarly has a different perspective on good market, and not necessarily totally different, but just has a really good view. He's done this before.

Tara Thurber: 35:38

Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 35:38

He has a great perspective on it all. And so I kind of made a point that I want to sit down with him, I want to understand his perspective on things so that I can think a little differently and evolve my thoughts on approach. And I think that surrounding yourself with people who can both be your cheerleader, but also give you something to think about to help you evolve as a professional, and as a person can make such a huge difference in kind of your development and career progression over time. So that's, anyways, my sister is role model.

Tara Thurber: 36:16

That's awesome. That's so awesome. And I think that makes one really, really important point, too, is to just take note that by asking a senior level person or a sister or somebody, I mean, some people I feel that they don't ask for their thoughts, or they don't ask to sit down with them, because they're almost afraid. And it's taking that extra step and being able to ask, Hey, do you have half an hour, I just want to pick your brain or I just want to hear your thoughts or your processes towards something. I think that's one major thing that sometimes I hear women not doing, because maybe it's a man that they're asking. And maybe they fear that that individual, maybe it's somebody that's in leadership above them, and they fear that they're going to be looked upon as as weak or not know what they're doing.

Karen Parisi: 37:29

Right.

Tara Thurber: 37:29

But I think women need to really kind of, like, get through that. That feeling and that mindset, and hopefully by asking and bringing curiosity to the table, I think is something that everybody is open to talking about, and to just not be afraid and just go for it and find those people.

Karen Parisi: 37:57

1,000% . Funny enough, I also was afraid to reach out to that board member. But I said, You know what, I'm doing it. Senate president and I did it and again, great you're absolutely right. You just need to push through that fear.

Tara Thurber: 38:11

Right? Yeah.

Karen Parisi: 38:12

And make it happen as best as you can.

Tara Thurber: 38:15

Perfect. Karen, thank you so, so much for joining us today. I really appreciate you giving us some of your time.

Karen Parisi: 38:22

I absolutely enjoyed it. So, thanks so much.

Tara Thurber: 38:25

Awesome. Have a great rest of your day. Okay.

Karen Parisi: 38:28

You too.

Tara Thurber: 38:30

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